Gibbs Farm
â[00:00:00]
Christa Hein: Hey there. Welcome to the Farm Educators Roadmap. I'm Christa Hein, former nonprofit girl turned farm education entrepreneur. I've spent the last 30 years creating hands-on programs that connect people to the land, animals, and the traditions that nourish our daily lives. If you're listening, you probably believe what I do, that farm education is needed now more than ever. Not just on rural farms, but in suburbs, cities, and everywhere in-between.
In this podcast, you'll hear real stories and practical advice from farm educators all across the country, people who are creating change through their programs in creative and inspiring ways.
Whether you're dreaming about starting your first program, are already knee deep in your own farm education work, or are just curious about how others are impacting their communities through farm education, you're in the right place. [00:01:00] Let's dig in.
Christa Hein: Welcome back to the Farm Educators Roadmap. I'm your host, Christa Hein, and today we're visiting a place where farm education meets living history. Gibbs Farm is an eight-acre site just outside St. Paul, Minnesota, a working historic farmstead and Dakota encampment, where visitors step right into the 1800âs.
But beyond the period costumes and heirloom crops, Gibbs farm is also an incredible example of how history and agriculture education can come together to teach kids about the land, sustainability, and community. I'm joined by two educators who know this place inside and out, Sammy Nelson, Director of Gibbs Farm, and Janie Bender, the Youth Programs Manager.
Both started here as seasonal guides and have grown into leadership roles, shaping the programs that bring the Gibbs story and farm education to life for thousands of students every year.
Sammy, Janie, [00:02:00] welcome.
Sammy: Hi. Thank you.
Janie: Thank you for having us.
Christa Hein: Absolutely. So, I want to start with your own stories, Sammy. You started as a site guide back in 2013 and fell in love with teaching kids here. What was it about that first experience that made you want to stay and grow into your current role?
Sammy: It was getting the opportunity to work so closely with children. I never had opportunities to babysit or anything like that, and I didn't have younger siblings. Having that experience the first year of teaching children about the site, interacting with them basically every day was really eye-opening and very fulfilling for me.
And I realized that I could combine my love of history with teaching children and getting them excited about history. So that's definitely something that spurred my interest.
Christa Hein: So, was your background in history then?
Sammy: Yes, I do have a degree in history.
Christa Hein: Okay, so that brought you to the Gibbs Farm, and then [00:03:00] you stayed in that role since 2013 as a guide and then moved on up?
Sammy: Yeah, so I had got my degree and shortly after graduating I had been volunteering at a different historic site and I found out about Gibbs Farm hiring for historic site interpreters. So, I started and then was in that position for a few years and I was assistant manager for a year as well. And then in 2017, moved to the director role.
Christa Hein: Awesome. And Janie, I heard that you actually came there as a kid yourself and that you also once said that you weren't going to teach history or work at a historic site, and yet here you are, leading programs at one. What pulled you back and how has that full-circle experience shaped how you teach now?
Janie: All of those things are true. I came here as a kid, and I remember really specifically being in the one room schoolhouse and feeling - I love the experience so much, feeling so immersed in history. Because there's a lot of [00:04:00] participation that could happen in a one room schoolhouse setting and things.
So, I loved it and then went off to college, got a degree in history. I have really studied a lot of ancient history, and I thought that was where I would end up. And so, when people would ask me with a history degree, they said, Where? What are you gonna do with that? And I said, well, I'll tell you what I'm not gonna do with it.
I'm not going to teach kids and I'm not going to do anything with local history. So clearly, I was meant to come back here. Yeah, it wasn't what I was originally thinking, but it ended up being this perfect blend of, at the heart of it, I think the reason I love history and other things like theater and books is 'cause I love stories and the way that, a lot of the programming is set up at Gibbs is telling stories and, I think that's such a good way to communicate.
I know that as a kid, when I came here being a part of that, I really loved it. And so, coming back many years later, was really cool to be on the other end [00:05:00] and facilitate that kind of sharing the story with kids. And, yeah, I don't know exactly how I ended up here, but I'm really glad that I did.
Christa Hein: Nice. Yeah. I wonder how many kids, how many educators have started off in that like one room schoolhouse? I have a very specific memory of being at a historic farm as a kid as well, and that's shaping me - along with Little House on the Prairie. But yeah, what that leads us to later on, you never know. It just is so inspiring.
So, I want to ask about Gibbs Farm itself. It sounds like an incredible place, part historic farm, part cultural center, and part outdoor classroom. Can you paint a picture of what the farm looks like and what students get to see, touch, or do when they visit?
Sammy: Yeah, so it is an eight-acre site, like you said, which is part of the original Gibbs homestead. So, Jane and Heman Gibbs built their farm here and we still have their farmhouse and a few other buildings associated with the farmstead. But [00:06:00] Jane Gibbs, she grew up at a Dakota Village. She was not a Dakota person herself but spent many years there as a child and was very involved with the people of that village and maintained that friendship as an adult too.
So, we do both of those interpretations. So, we have like the kind of farmstead with a barn and farm animals. And then on the other half of our site we have a restored native prairie and some kind of small woods lining the property. And that's where we have our outdoor classrooms, where we do our Dakota historical interpretation.
And then we also have a replica bark lodge, which is the type of home Dakota people lived in in the summer, in the 1800s. And some tipi as well. So, we have kind of two ends of the site, but it's really a beautiful little oasis in-between St. Paul and Minneapolis.
Christa Hein: That's awesome. So, you're both teaching about the past, but you're also giving kids hands-on experiences that connect to farming today.
How do you help [00:07:00] students when they visit, draw connections between pioneer farming and the modern food system or sustainable agriculture?
Janie: I think especially, the kind of our biggest audience of students that we have coming are usually kindergarten through third grade. And so, they're early on in their academic and history journeys. And so really a lot of it is laying the foundation for what they're going to learn later on. And so, something as simple as knowing what your food looks like before it goes into the grocery store or before it gets processed is sometimes, you know, a brand-new thing for kids.
And so, for a lot of students, they might not have ever seen farm animals and things, and so we're very lucky that we get to have some live farm animals. We have several gardens and so getting to bring kids around to see those and getting them to see them while they're alive and growing and starting to make that connection, I'd say is probably - [00:08:00] we're really laying the groundwork for what they're going to do later on.
Sammy: We have, just thinking hands-on, we have two particular things that stand out in my mind as part of our field trip tours, and one of them is a garden skit where we explain how the Dakota would traditionally plant their corn and beans and squash. And so, we actually have the children come up and act as if they are the corn and beans and squash.
And they have, we have them all up together at the front of the station space, holding corn cobs that are crocheted and it's very, very cute. And then we, as part of our Dakota tour, we also have, we talk about harvesting wild rice, which the Dakota did during this time, and some folks still do today. But we have them go through the process of harvesting wild rice and acting out what that looks like with different, objects and things.
Christa Hein: Awesome. I was going to ask if the kids got to watch people do some of the activities as far as like harvest or planting or if [00:09:00] they got to take part in them themselves. So maybe it sounds like a little of both.
Sammy: Yeah, we have a lot of our farming - our planting is pretty small scale since we only have eight acres and a lot of it's taken up by a prairie and buildings. But it as our summer camps, they do some of the planting and harvesting from our kitchen garden. So that's definitely something they get to partake in. Not so much on field trips, but yeah.
Janie: They, and they really, it's really fun to get to have the kids get their hands into the dirt and especially towards the end of summer, getting to harvest things. This summer especially, we had some really ginormous like squashes and all sorts of stuff, and so they harvest it.
If it's something like a carrot that they can eat there, then and there, we'll wash it off and they get to eat it. And eating something fresh out of the garden is a cool connection for them. And sometimes they bring home a giant zucchini and their parents pick them up from camp and go, what in the world are we gonna do with [00:10:00] this?
Christa Hein: So, you welcome so many different age groups. What do you think are some of the most successful farm education activities for younger kids versus older students?
Sammy: I would say for younger children, we try to keep it as hands-on and fast paced as possible, just to keep their attention spans and make sure that we're kind of highlighting what weâre maybe just what we see is the most exciting things on the site. So that's like seeing the farm animals, doing some of those skits, going into the different buildings or spaces, like they get so excited the second they see the tipi, they want to go inside and look at that.
So really kind of keeping things moving. And that's again, as Janie mentioned, kind of our biggest group. But the older students, I think they really just - I feel like they're more shy at first when they get here. They're quieter, they don't want to do as much, but then once they get into it, I think they really start to see [00:11:00] connections and they bring up such interesting questions sometimes in their own - kind of how they're connecting it in their mind and wanting to share that with us.
So that's really special to see that. And it's fun to not have to provide so much initial context like what we have to do when the children are younger, which it's totally understandable, but it's kind of fun to have those older students to get the opportunity to dive more into it.
Christa Hein: Yeah. So how do you decide what kinds of programs to offer? Do you base it on the school curriculum or what the community needs or the site's natural seasonal rhythms?
Sammy: So, we have a set of various set field trip experiences. So, they're broken into our Pioneer tour, which covers the life of the Gibbs family. They go with the schoolhouse, dip a candle, then our Dakota tour, which covers 1830s Dakota history at a particular village. And then we have one that kind of combines both of them.
It's just called our combo tour. And then [00:12:00] we have some groups that come and do the whole day. So, they do a full Dakota tour and a full pioneer tour. And then we have worked with some school districts to do a kindergarten tour too, which is focused more on early science education.
So, it's really that we often are doing the same kinds of tours, but our staff are so great, that we kind of can shift focus or shift how we do that tour, depending on that age group. So, it might just be like, okay, we're making sure for these kindergartners, we're going to bring out a lot more examples, materials.
We're talking about the animals, like what do the different eggs look like and feathers and things like that. Or are we going to make something a little bit more hands-on than if they were fifth or sixth graders or something where you really can just talk to them more about what they're learning.
Christa Hein: So, I see you also host seasonal [00:13:00] events and camps. So, what are some of the creative ways that you've woven farm education into those?
Janie: Yeah, so probably one of the most obvious connections for us was we have a kids on the farm camp. And so that's three days. They're half days where we have about 30 campers and they come and they get to experience what life would be like as an early Minnesota farm kid. So, they'll spend some time in the one room schoolhouse, which I'm very partial to.
And then doing all sorts of chores as well as playing early Minnesota games and playing with toys and things like that. It's amazing. As soon as there's a chore that is not mandatory for a kid, they're way more excited to do it.
Christa Hein: Yes.
Janie: And so, we have them feed the animals every day and they get to, some of them get to scoop chicken poop and some get to scoop goose poop and feed the animals, make sure they have water, all that [00:14:00] stuff.
They work in the garden. They do the wash and things like that. And so, really trying to, as much as possible and as much as makes sense and is safe, trying to have the kids have hands-on experiences in the gardens that we do have, in with the animals that we have and things - that's probably the most agriculture heavy one I think we have.
We do also have a Dakota camp. So, it's the same setup where it's three days, three half days, about 30 kids. And their emphasis is on what Dakota seasonal life was like in the 1830s. And so, they also talk about, they do the things like the garden skit that Sammy mentioned.
They also make corn husk dolls. So, talking about how, you know, the parts of the plant could be made into toys and things. They get to eat wild rice. They get a maple sugar candy. So, talking a lot about kinds of connections to the natural world and harvesting and how that would've looked in the Dakota context.
So, it's [00:15:00] involved in every single one of our camps to a varying degree. But those would be probably the two. Two ones where they fit most, most solid.
Christa Hein: Oh, that's beautiful. When they're working on the farm, like say in the gardens, are they using historic type tools or modern-day tools?
Janie: That is an excellent question. Mostly we have modern day tools. We have a lot of historic tools to show them. We actually have a room in the farmhouse that has been converted into what we call the farm lab, and it has plows and scythes and all sorts of tools and things. So, they get to see those.
But for safety purposes, we use gloves and all of the modern day things. And that same thing when we're dealing with animals. We talk about what it would be like to have animals in the 19th century, but then we talk about how we're able to care for them in a different way now that we have more access to information and tools and things, and so we try to do a good job of communicating - this probably didn't look [00:16:00] like this, but here's what we've learned and why it's a little bit different now.
Christa Hein: Nice. Now since youâre representing a very specific cultural heritage, how does your partnership with the Dakota community influence how you teach about land stewardship and relationship to agriculture?
Sammy: Yeah, so we've, been working with the Dakota community as well as descendants of the particular village that we discuss at Gibbs for almost 30 years now, I think. So a really long time. And we have relationships with both individuals in the community as well as some organizations. We have a lot of Native run organizations in the Twin Cities.
But I would say that we've really been asked to share a very specific historical village and kind of exactly what life was like while Jane Gibbs was living there. So, we sort of see the Dakota interpretation at Gibbs as an introduction for both children, but also other visitors who might not be familiar with Dakota history.
And [00:17:00] then from Gibbs, if they haven't encountered some of these other Dakota or other Native led organizations, we kind of provide resources to seek those out, to learn a little bit more about Dakota people today. We're lucky enough to be able to incorporate some Dakota language into our tours so that we are still connecting children to an existing language and to people who are here today, even though we're talking about their history a little bit more, to make sure that we're not sounding as if Dakota people aren't around anymore.
But so, we kind of see it as like a jumping off point. And, even when we send post-tour information to teachers that visit us, we recommend other organizations that they can visit to learn a little bit more about like modern stewardship and things like that.
Christa Hein: Nice.
Janie: We give a little bit of a nod, we want to make sure that we're not speaking for Dakota people whose, you know, it's not our culture - but being excited to [00:18:00] share all the things that they've asked us to share. And one of the things that's come up in the language that we get to use with the students, is in an introduction.
We introduce ourselves in the Dakota language and then use the word which means, âwelcome my relativesâ and is a good way to set up how for Dakota people, everything can be related and people and everything in nature and things, and that sets up a little bit of the context for how we then go in and talk about like wild ricing or maple sugaring and things like that.
So yeah, I'd say that's how we kind of start to frame it for the Dakota tour for sure.
Christa Hein: That's a beautiful way to start to kind of bring them down and settle them into like the relationship that was had with the land and that appreciation. Nice. So, you've both seen hundreds of students come through, how do you measure or notice the impact that you think this kind of experiential farm learning [00:19:00] offers?
Janie: That's a fun one because we, I'm in charge of collecting a lot of the surveys that we get from teachers. And so, we give teachers both a paper survey that they can mail back to us or an electronic survey and we ask some specific things about like, does it meet what you're expecting for state standards and all of that.
But one of the questions is, what is some of the most memorable things or what do your students talk about after leaving the field trip. And that's really fun and nearly always, it's the animals, the tipi. If they went into the farmhouse, they talked about the chamber pot. Always a big hit. And so that's one way that we're able to hear. We have a pretty good percentage rate of teachers that reply back, and that's been really helpful in kind of informing how we make tweaks and things, going forward and things we make sure to emphasize to staff. But a lot of teacher evaluations is really helpful.
A really nice kind of confirmation that things are working is [00:20:00] that we'll often have kids on a field trip and then they come back later in the year with their family for an event or on the weekends or something like that, and the parents will say, oh yeah, they came on a field trip and they loved it so much that now they wanted us to come and see it too.
And, and so I'd say that's the biggest compliment, when we see people return and yeah, that's always really fun. Just get to see them come back and get to be the tour guide then for their family.
Christa Hein: Yeah, absolutely. So, if another historic site or small community farm wanted to bring in more hands-on farm education, what advice would you give them?
Sammy: Funny enough, we recently applied to do a conference presentation that was a little bit about utilizing the natural world at your site, no matter the size. So, I think one thing is, do you have space, even if you don't have acres of land, do you have enough room for a small garden, a raised bed, even [00:21:00] pots that you can grow vegetables or flowers in.
Or that the kids could even plant too if you're, if you are having children visit your site. So, I think that's kind of a big thing is where can you put a garden, 'cause they're so perfectly hands-on and perfectly sized for children.
And then another thing that really connects kids so much and they get so excited about is farm animals. So even if you can have some chickens, sort of a more manageable animals, like that, it really brings a lot. And so many children at least that come to our site have never seen farm animals in real life. I think Janie said that. So that's just, it's really like an eye opening moment for them.
Sometimes they'll see the animals and they go, you know, what is that a dog? But it's a goat. I think a, a raccoon has been, or a goose has been mistaken for a raccoon. So that's kind of a thing for us. And I know, keeping animals, there's a lot of like, probably city [00:22:00] ordinances and things, across the country for that.
But I think those two things are really a big hit. And I think that the gardens and planting especially can be really doable at most places.
Janie: Yeah, I think those two, those two things, if you're able to have, those are probably the best tools. But I think whatever the kind of specific goal is, or audience, having some something tangible and hands-on, if you don't have gardens and things like that, dried corn will keep kids entertained for ages, seeing that corn comes in different colors. There's a lot of, it's kind of, you need to like step back a little bit. You know all of this stuff as a grownup because you've learned it at some point, but for a kid who's seeing and experiencing it for the very first time, how like shocking it can be that, this is what a plant looks like before it's grown. A potato has leaves and all sorts of things like that.
So kind of trying to find that [00:23:00] sense of wonder in whatever and trying to see it through a kid's eyes and then figuring out a way to make it tangible, I feel like makes a huge difference.
Christa Hein: Oh, great. All great advice. So, what's next for Gibbs Farm? Any new programs or collaborations you're excited about?
Sammy: We had a summer camp called Peewees, and it's four and five year olds. It's just two hours. and we have a number throughout the summer, so it kind of gets mixed and match. Like we have some that come to every single one. Some children that just come to one or two, but we're trying it in the winter this year, so we are a mostly seasonal site 'cause a lot of our buildings are historic. And we do have one building that is year-round and perfect for small groups. And we thought, preschool age studentsâ parents might be interested in having them do some other activities during the winter months. And you know, we have the tipi up that they can go and visit in the wintertime.
We can play around in the [00:24:00] snow. We have our farm birds here in the winter, so maybe help us take care of them. So, I think that's something that I'm pretty excited about for this year, is to try that out and see how it goes.
Janie: Yeah. One thing I'm excited about and very hopeful that everything will come together is that, for the past several years, all of our farm animals have had to leave the site to over winter somewhere else because we don't have a great space that's - we have a historic barn, which is okay to store some things in, but you don't want animals in there all winter long. And so they had to be transported to different farms throughout the years and then come back in the spring. And, we have been working on doing some fundraising to get money for a year-round barn to keep our animals year-round, keep them comfortable in all the modern conveniences they deserve. And, hopefully we'll be able to use it in the future. We're hoping that it could - it'll probably be done next year before next winter. And then having [00:25:00] programs like the peewees during the winter that Sammy mentioned and being able to bring kids in and experience animal care during the winter and things like that would be a really fun element.
So, I'm excited about that and I'm also excited not to have to transport goats and sheep.
Christa Hein: Yeah. So, I'm curious, how do you see the role of a historic farm evolving in the next decade, especially as more people are looking to reconnect with food and land?
Janie: I think there's definitely a growing interest in, for parents and teachers in finding ways for kids to not do digital things or anything virtual. And so, I think what's really cool is not necessarily by design, but we don't have screens out here. It's just the way a historic farm happens to be.
And I think that's an experience that a lot of parents and teachers are looking for, for their kids to have to be unplugged and away from things. And so kind of leaning [00:26:00] into that, I think that a site like historic farms is going to be a sought-after experience. I think, you know, there will always be kids who want to go, because they already love animals.
But I think that it will be appealing for a lot of parents and caretakers that want to have that different kind of experience for their kids. So, I think that's going to be one reason why it's going to be popular going forward.
Sammy: Yeah. And I think just, it seems that people are more interested too in, you know, native planting.
So, our prairie kind of lends itself to that. And even like more home crafts. Our third person on the management team who's not here today, Claire, she coordinates a lot of our craft programs. And so, she's pressed flowers that are from the site, like dipping large candles.
So, these kind of home crafts that people get really interested in too, and I think that'll just continue to be more popular as well.
Christa Hein: Yeah, a lot of those heritage crafts [00:27:00] are so popular and growing and people coming back to gardening. Yeah. Awesome.
Well, I have just loved hearing how you've blended farm life, history and education into something truly alive at Gibbs Farm. Before we wrap up, how can people find you online to learn more?
Janie: Our website is one of the best spots. So that's, www.rchs.com. That is because we are part of the Ramsey County Historical Society, but we're very prominently on that website. And then Gibbs Farm is also on Facebook and Instagram too.
Sammy: We do also have a little YouTube channel. We haven't posted in a while, but we do have a series of videos with featuring our goose, Rosebud, and her voiceovers all about her life.
Christa Hein: Nice. Well, thank you both so much for sharing your stories and all you do to keep farm education vibrant and connected to our roots.
Sammy: Thank you.
Janie: Thank you for having us.
Christa Hein: Absolutely. And to our listeners, I hope this episode sparks some ideas for how you [00:28:00] can weave history and farming together to connect people to the land.
If this conversation inspired you, take a moment to follow the podcast and leave a review to help other farm educators find these stories.
Until next time, keep teaching, keep growing, and keep planting those seeds of connection.
Christa Hein: Hey farm educators. I hope you enjoyed today's episode. Before you go, I've got something special for you. If you're ready to build a farm education program that people are excited to book, grab my free guide, Five Simple Steps to Growing an In-Demand Farm Education Program. It's packed with the same steps I used to grow my own farm education business.
It'll help you get noticed, attract clients, and make an impact. Just head over to www.farmeducatorsroadmap.com/fivesimplesteps to get your free copy. It's quick, easy, and will make your programs irresistible. I can't wait to see what you create. [00:29:00] Thanks for listening, and I'll catch you in the next episode.
